Conjoint Gaming [Game On]
CG Main => Debate Forum => Topic started by: Old Crow on June 06, 2011, 10:35:48 AM
-
Well the question is simple. which would you rather have for World War 3, Zombie apocalypse, etc...
Both have their pros and cons, but if i had to choose one it would be the AK all the way. Never jams, full auto, and ammo is everywhere even in the States. Love the M16, very accurate but that direct impingement system just jams the weapon way too easily.
-
what is it with you americans and your gung (and zombie apocolypse). Why are you so obsessed with killing things :s
(IRL)
anyways i was thinking about ak-47 but that's jus personally in counter strike:source...
-
what is it with you americans and your gung (and zombie apocolypse). Why are you so obsessed with killing things :s
(IRL)
anyways i was thinking about ak-47 but that's jus personally in counter strike:source...
I assume you mean gun??? hey we love guns. just a fact. im working on getting my fifth!!!
-
In the real world, the AK-47. In CS:S however, the AK's accuracy blows, so I would use M16.
-
Okay first of all: I did not post that post above me. Whitellama GTFO my account.
In the real world, the AK-47 is a lot more of an automatic weapon, and the m16 is more of a rifle. Ak-47 loses accuracy but has a LOT more power. The m16 however has a very long barrel and is more accurate, used at a longer range.
Ak-47 ftw. It makes easy headshots when holding still.
-
The AK is probably more versatile and all around useful compared to the M16. Sure the M16 is probably a better gun but the AK has it's better points. Cheap, plenty of them around and ammo is sure to be a plenty
-
Okay first of all: I did not post that post above me. Whitellama GTFO my account.
In the real world, the AK-47 is a lot more of an automatic weapon, and the m16 is more of a rifle. Ak-47 loses accuracy but has a LOT more power. The m16 however has a very long barrel and is more accurate, used at a longer range.
Ak-47 ftw. It makes easy headshots when holding still.
AK-47 is an assault rifle, as is the M16... Both have fully automatic options.
M16's barrel doesn't increase it's accuracy, it creates stability.
AK-47 is easier to rely on and doesn't need constant cleaning.. In fact, you could probably find some AK in a Vietnam swamp area that hasn't been used in years and it'd probably still fire without doing much maintenance.
The problem with the M16 is the sheer fact that the gun has always been known to jam often, and the AK's raw power would be much more useful. The M16 rounds are more common throughout the US, meaning you'll be able to find ammo for it more often [Invasion being possible in WW3]... Which is a definite plus.
Is it the stereotypical zombie outbreak or L4D2?
Now, I'm assuming what model of M16 you're talking about, so don't go "ORLY!? DERP DERP DERP"
-
Game does NOT equal reality. In actuality, the AK-47 is of the same era / age of the M-14. The AK-74 and the M-16 are of the same era / age.
The AK-47 is a heavier caliber (7.62x39mm) and was designed for the two week old conscript to be able to maintain and shoot. It is a less accurate rifle. Particularly at long range. It never was designed to be a long range rifle.
The M-16 initial design was to be a guard rifle, for the air force. Light weight, and not on the front line. However, the US Military wanted to increase the amount of ammo the soldier carried, without increasing weight. The .223 round is used to do this. The original M-16 had severe issues, now mostly resolved, except the lack of stopping power of the .223. The M-16 is more accurate at long range. This is a throw back. US Mil (particularly the Marines) likes long range accuracy. The M-4 variant is close in, and is not effective at long range (loss of velocity due to short barrel.) In Afghanistan, the lack of penetration of the .223 at long range has been an issue - in Afghanistan, the Taliban use snipers to full effect, this is why the issuance 7.62 Nato caliber rifles is occurring.
-
the 5.56mm Nato may not have the penetration that the 7.62mmX39 does but the bullet does tumble much earlier then the 7.62, thus causing much more tissue damage.Fighting Taliban in Afghan, who for the most part probably aren't wearing body armor, it'll incapacitate them much better then the AK round would.
-
The AK-47 is way less acurate. but you lose the power of the not jamming with the m16
Ak all the way.
trollface
-
the 5.56mm Nato may not have the penetration that the 7.62mmX39 does but the bullet does tumble much earlier then the 7.62, thus causing much more tissue damage.Fighting Taliban in Afghan, who for the most part probably aren't wearing body armor, it'll incapacitate them much better then the AK round would.
Yes, and no. Due to the shortening of the M16 barrel - for variants, like the M-4 - the tumbling does not occur as it should. In addition, the velocity loss, also due to the shorten barrels, means the Afghans do not have to wear body armor, but just be far enough away. And, due to the velocity loss, the round does not fragment, as designed, at far ranges. Right now the major issue is snipers in Afghanistan.
An old bolt action rifle in a heavy caliber, like 7.62x54r, or 30.06, etc. out range the rifles the standard US Soldier would normally carry. This is why the US Mil is sending M-14 variant sniper rifles and (supposedly) issuing them at the platoon level.
Remember, the 5.56 Nato round is a very small bullet. Tumbling and fragmentation are the keys to getting stopping power in such a small round. It is a 55-62 grain bullet. Roughly 1/3 the size of the 7.62Nato.
Even the Wiki points to stopping power concerns: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/5.56%C3%9745mm_NATO
In comparison, the AK-47 shoots a 7.62x39 round, 123-154 grain bullet a x2 to x3 weight difference. It transfers 2x the amount of energy.
However, the 7.62x39 round does not tumble nor fragment well, which can lead to stopping power issues. Newer ammo corrects this a bit by design.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/7.62%C3%9739mm
-
The AK-47 is way less acurate. but you lose the power of the not jamming with the m16
Ak all the way.
trollface
To be fair, the AK-47 is accurate in the sense that it hits what you're aiming at (Kind of?).. but the recoil is horrible.
-
but the recoil is horrible.
pussy :p
-
pussy :p
>mfw
(http://memeshack.com/myfacewhen/MyFaceWhen_1300828570960.jpg)
-
While I'd have to agree that an AK is great if your at medium range, i'd rather have the M16 on single shot and pop the zombies closest to me. Hit and run>Spray and Pray in a zombo apoc for the simple fact that a heashot would drop a zombie faster then two-five body shots. Of course that's just my preferance but yall can go with the AK if you want. Also even more truthfully if we're talkin about Zombie Apoc I'd go with something like an H&K Mp5 (with a few clips) for medium-long range fightin and either a pistol grip Pump action or sawed off shotgun for House clearing. Just saying >.>
-
Yes, and no. Due to the shortening of the M16 barrel - for variants, like the M-4 - the tumbling does not occur as it should. In addition, the velocity loss, also due to the shorten barrels, means the Afghans do not have to wear body armor, but just be far enough away. And, due to the velocity loss, the round does not fragment, as designed, at far ranges. Right now the major issue is snipers in Afghanistan.
An old bolt action rifle in a heavy caliber, like 7.62x54r, or 30.06, etc. out range the rifles the standard US Soldier would normally carry. This is why the US Mil is sending M-14 variant sniper rifles and (supposedly) issuing them at the platoon level.
Only thing about the M14 is that they are replacing it in the service by the M110 semi-auto sniper system based of the M16, but it is a 7.62X51 NATO round just like the M-14 uses. Not sure how the army issues them but i know the Marine Corps gives them to Designated marksmen, aka the same role the M-14 has at the moment
-
Yes, and no. Due to the shortening of the M16 barrel - for variants, like the M-4 - the tumbling does not occur as it should. In addition, the velocity loss, also due to the shorten barrels, means the Afghans do not have to wear body armor, but just be far enough away. And, due to the velocity loss, the round does not fragment, as designed, at far ranges. Right now the major issue is snipers in Afghanistan.
An old bolt action rifle in a heavy caliber, like 7.62x54r, or 30.06, etc. out range the rifles the standard US Soldier would normally carry. This is why the US Mil is sending M-14 variant sniper rifles and (supposedly) issuing them at the platoon level.
Only thing about the M14 is that they are replacing it in the service by the M110 semi-auto sniper system based of the M16, but it is a 7.62X51 NATO round just like the M-14 uses. Not sure how the army issues them but i know the Marine Corps gives them to Designated marksmen, aka the same role the M-14 has at the moment
... Because the M14 is totally 100% a sniper rifle? @_@
-
... Because the M14 is totally 100% a sniper rifle? @_@
Not a full range sniper rifle but it is accurate enough to be employed as a DMR or designated marksman rifle. they're not snipers but members that take important shots for the squad. Basically the best shooter of the unit becomes a DMR. Of course the M-14 was employed in Vietnam by the army as a sniper rifle for a while till they came out with the M24.
-
i would choose the ak larger round and more reliable
-
"In CS:S however, the AK's accuracy blows"
WRONG
AK-47 is way more accurate in css than the M16 by far frogc00l
AK-47 is good at close and long range ,M16 in css is shit at long range but only good at close. People who think the AK-47 in css is shit is because they arn't using the gun correctly.
Which would be whitellama ^>^
Anyway, just to point it out, the gun in css is actually a m4a1 not a m16, the m16 has a much longer barrel. IRl the m16 would be more accurate, idk about the m4a1, but the AK-47 is definitely an easy headshot in CSS.
-
Without no doubt the AK-47, but then again I wouldn't get my hand on one... Norway and it's rules, I know one place I can get an M16 but oh well, that same place has a spas (whatever else it is called).
I am an impatient man, meaning I can not sit still somewhere with an accurate weapon, like the m16.
AK-47 is much more of an assult weapon which fits me more, not saying I would run into enemy fire... just saying I would not sit still for ages upon end.
Also as you said AK-47 is more reliable and I feel it has more times in which it is good to use strategically.
-
ak, doesnt jam.
-
mac-10 Break yo self Fools!
-
AK all the way
-
Its so simple that a child is capable of operating an ak47 (Literally, they do today).
Dont mind the idiot...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CE_gm00ebFY
As for an m16, they are oftenly used during recons and tactical extractions.
In situations such as Urban Warfare, both are commonly used. Ever wondered why?
-
FAKE.
-
For my first post, it saddens me that I must tell you that you all are a bunch of idiots. Actually, I rephrase that. All of you who picked AK47 are idiots. The M16 would wreck the AK47 hands down. Sure the AK47's rounds leave a bigger impact, but you better hit your first or second shot because after that and you are going full-auto, you will be shooting the sky. The M16 on the other hand is much for effective since you can empty and entire clip, full-auto, into a 3x3 foot box at 50 yards and hit every shot. I've shot both and, from experience, the AK47 is impossible to have the same accuracy as the M16 unless you fire it in two- to three-round bursts.
The M16 is better than the Ak47 unless, of course, you are standing 5 yards from your opponent.
-
For my first post, it saddens me that I must tell you that you all are a bunch of idiots. Actually, I rephrase that. All of you who picked AK47 are idiots. The M16 would wreck the AK47 hands down. Sure the AK47's rounds leave a bigger impact, but you better hit your first or second shot because after that and you are going full-auto, you will be shooting the sky. The M16 on the other hand is much for effective since you can empty and entire clip, full-auto, into a 3x3 foot box at 50 yards and hit every shot. I've shot both and, from experience, the AK47 is impossible to have the same accuracy as the M16 unless you fire it in two- to three-round bursts.
The M16 is better than the Ak47 unless, of course, you are standing 5 yards from your opponent.
its hands down that the M16 has the better accuracy, and in full auto it would beat the AK too but most of the M16's for the Army and Marines only come in single shot and three round burst right? And i would take a look at the bigger picture. Accuracy M16<AK, Reliability AK<M16 and so on!
-
Better solution,
(http://28.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_lk0t8uMfOU1qjq9u9o1_500.jpg)
-
(http://memearchive.net/memerial.net/page/2435.jpg)
Revolver
-
(http://memearchive.net/memerial.net/page/2435.jpg)
Revolver
good job
between options
A and B
you chose C
and failed the test
-
Indeed. Also to anyone trying to debate the accuracy of either weapon I'd like to point out one thing. You never ever see any soldier or Terrorist just spray an entire AK Mag at the enemy, there are a few reasons for this. First off is the amount of time it takes to fire an entire clip at an enemy. Even if you say it takes two-three seconds to do so you have to realize that to do that you expose yourself for a full two-four seconds AT LEAST. Meaning your a sitting duck for anyone that peeps around the corner to single shot you in the face. Same with the the M16, it's not often they go full auto since it's usually a waste of ammo. Unless the guy's out of cover your better of with a single tap or even a short burst when he pops out to look for you.
So In this respect I'd still rather have the M16 for the lesser recoil and greater accuracy at a further range. Perfect in a Zombie Apoc because you can headshot. Also if anyone says they'd rather have an AK cuz they don't like headshots then fuck the AK and go for a shotgun, more likely to drop a zombie in one shot then an AK can unless you go for Headshots.
-
Well zombies don't have armed weapons do they?
-
Not unless their from Halo
-
If I had to pay money for one I'd go with the 47, you don't have to baby it, you just have to kill stuff with it.
-
Pretty sure most people in this thread have never fired either of those guns. As someone who has (and owns an Arsenal AK), I can say that they're both great guns and would both be useful in a zombie apocalypse. I'd probably take the AK because it uses a more powerful caliber, and because it's *generally* more durable than the M-16.
To the person who said something about M16 having less recoil, that's not always true. Type of ammo and the specific brand and model of gun all affect recoil. They both have considerable recoil. And to the person who said clips, it's magazines. Please do not talk as if you're an expert on guns if you can't even get basic terms right.
-
On a completely unrelated side note: a 5.56mm round doesn't have a lot of stopping power if you put it in a zombie's chest, but neither does a 7.62mm round to a zombie's chest. An ideal round and rifle for the Apocolypse would actually be a .22 hunting rifle. There's a good chance the .22 will enter the brain and ricochet in the skull, tearing up the grey matter as it goes. It also has very little recoil in comparison AND it's a much lighter round then a 5.56mm or 7.62mm.
----
But if I had to pick? I'd take the M16A4. Plenty accurate, and if you pace your shots you can drop a zombie for every bullet in your clip, and ammo is plentiful here in the States. The AK would be good for a pray n' spray weapon if the horde was too close to take time for accurate headshots.
-
"Also to anyone trying to debate the accuracy of either weapon I'd like to point out one thing. You never ever see any soldier or Terrorist just spray an entire AK Mag at the enemy..."
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RomKO0fs9AI
Video of Libyan Rebels "spraying" with AK-47.
The recoil of an AK-47 is severe compared to a M-16. (In general, I have shot both.) But it is not severe compared to higher calibers (say a 7.62x54r, or 30.06.) The reason the Soviets and Americans went to smaller calibers after WWII, were to lessen the recoil, and increase the volume of firepower. The AK-47 and the M-14 were the first real step down. The AK-74 and the M-16 is yet a further drop. Now there is consideration as to whether or not they dropped too far. Gone to too small a caliber with too little stopping power.
FYI: Everyone please get the nomenclature correct. Just because the Media calls it a "clip," does not mean they are correct...
Clip DNE Magazine. A Clip is used to FEED a Magazine.
(http://www.reoiv.com/images/random/clipmag.jpg)
Picture of a Clip feeding a Magazine.
(http://i440.photobucket.com/albums/qq122/mojo00_pics/Stuff/clip-vs-magazine-gun-500x394.jpg)
As for Zombies, well a 22lr might not be the best idea. AS it might not penetrate the skull. And aiming for an eye socket from a distance is, well, very hard in perfect conditions. The Zombie Outbreak will not be perfect conditions...
-
There's a good chance the .22 will enter the brain and ricochet in the skull, tearing up the grey matter as it goes.
I read the same thing in that one zombie survival guide by Max Brookes lol
-
Neither.
ROCKET LAUNCHER FTW!
(http://jsclan.com/wordpress/images/Sprays/RocketLawnchair.jpg)
-
ak47.
easy to use, requires little to no maintenance.
-
ak47.
easy to use, requires little to no maintenance.
Except for when you run out of ammo because it isn't half as plentiful as 5.62mm...
-
I just like m16's better pretty much for looks, in reality idk whats better, but m4/m16s will always be my favorate
;D
-
Except for when you run out of ammo because it isn't half as plentiful as 5.62mm...
Except the fact that they're sold in every ammunition/gun shop.
-
ak47.
easy to use, requires little to no maintenance.
Except for when you run out of ammo because it isn't half as plentiful as 5.62mm...
i think you mean 5.56. also, homie please Russia be making them 7.62's all day erry day.
-
7.62mm rounds are easy to get here in the states because of the Ruger Mini thirty and AK clones and because SKS's are easy to come by. On top of the millions of foreign made rounds that are sold here.
-
7.62mm rounds are easy to get here in the states because of the Ruger Mini thirty and AK clones and because SKS's are easy to come by. On top of the millions of foreign made rounds that are sold here.
(http://cache.ohinternet.com/images/thumb/3/3e/Cat_pushing_watermelon_argument_invalid.jpg/120px-Cat_pushing_watermelon_argument_invalid.jpg)
--------
Anyway, I rescind my ammo portion. Still my opinion that the M16A4 with the M203 (HE Frag) is the winrar here =p
-
I'd have to say m16.
The ak is for uncultured third-world renegades who have daddy issues.
-
But the AK never jams trollface
-
I'd have to say m16.
The ak is for uncultured third-world renegades who have daddy issues.
Ya the ak is cheaply made but still never jams like the m16 does
-
M16A4 jams are actually pretty uncommon. And I've seen AK-47s jam up before in person (poor maintenance). AK-47s aren't made like they used to be; now the vast majority are cheap knockoffs of the real deal. The M16A4 is more expensive, but that means higher quality material and parts.
-
ak. i believe to be a more durable and reliable weapon. i would feel a lot safer knowing im killing people and it wont jam :D
-
I'd have to say m16.
The ak is for uncultured third-world renegades who have daddy issues.
Ya the ak is cheaply made but still never jams like the m16 does
It's not that it never jams, it's just that it's exceptionally easy to maintain. Like Takeo said, most AKs today are cobbled-together cheap knockoffs.
While the ak can stand up to a good amount of neglect and abuse, an American soldier wouldn't put his gun through half the things insurgents do anyways.
-
I'd have to say m16.
The ak is for uncultured third-world renegades who have daddy issues.
Ya the ak is cheaply made but still never jams like the m16 does
It's not that it never jams, it's just that it's exceptionally easy to maintain. Like Takeo said, most AKs today are cobbled-together cheap knockoffs.
While the ak can stand up to a good amount of neglect and abuse, an American soldier wouldn't put his gun through half the things insurgents do anyways.
Yes but there are still AK's that are made up to standard by the Yugo's and the Russians. I'm sure you all have seen videos of people putting an AK into mud, literally caking it and then pulling it out and firing it. The M16 just cant do that. I wouldn't doubt that in the mid east they are using Ak's that have been used for 20 years and haven't been maintained and much more of them are Chinese AK's.
-
in TTT: AK47 ofc :D!
in real life: M16
-
the ak to me i still believe as a more reliable gun.
when shot for shot counts i am choosing the ak :)
-
*WAY OF TOPIC*
what happend to the volcan?
guy remember volcan in volcan town? :D
-
*WAY OF TOPIC*
what happend to the volcan?
guy remember volcan in volcan town? :D
That belongs in ttt.
That isn't even how you spell it.
This doesn't even have the somewhat relevance of being a real gun, because it isn't a real gun.
-
Miniguns arent real guns! NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!
Now i'll never fufill my dream of becoming a heavy and eating magically appearing sandviches.
-
Miniguns arent real guns! NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!
Now i'll never fufill my dream of becoming a heavy and eating magically appearing sandviches.
Right?
-
Miniguns arent real guns! NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!
Now i'll never fufill my dream of becoming a heavy and eating magically appearing sandviches.
Right?
Left.
-
*WAY OF TOPIC*
what happend to the volcan?
guy remember volcan in volcan town? :D
That belongs in ttt.
That isn't even how you spell it.
This doesn't even have the somewhat relevance of being a real gun, because it isn't a real gun.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/M61_Vulcan
It truly isn't a real gun.
-
*WAY OF TOPIC*
what happend to the volcan?
guy remember volcan in volcan town? :D
That belongs in ttt.
That isn't even how you spell it.
This doesn't even have the somewhat relevance of being a real gun, because it isn't a real gun.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/M61_Vulcan
It truly isn't a real gun.
Looks pretty fake to me, but i'll admit, you're pretty good at photoshopping.
-
*WAY OF TOPIC*
what happend to the volcan?
guy remember volcan in volcan town? :D
...i cant tell if you guys are being sarcastic or not o.o
That belongs in ttt.
That isn't even how you spell it.
This doesn't even have the somewhat relevance of being a real gun, because it isn't a real gun.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/M61_Vulcan
It truly isn't a real gun.
Looks pretty fake to me, but i'll admit, you're pretty good at photoshopping.
-
ummmmmmm off topic much lol trollface
-
*WAY OF TOPIC*
what happend to the volcan?
guy remember volcan in volcan town? :D
That belongs in ttt.
That isn't even how you spell it.
This doesn't even have the somewhat relevance of being a real gun, because it isn't a real gun.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/M61_Vulcan
It truly isn't a real gun.
Ok, let me rephrase that.
The vulcan, as it is represented in ttt is not real.
It is a weapon attached to the side of a chopper.
-
Thank you <3
-
AK-47 kalashnikov because of it's sturdy base and ability to withstand inside infractions like dirt, sand and blood. It's used almost world-wide and with that almost limit-less ammunition, also made by the Russians parrot
-
AK-47 less chance to jam and the mag is just as large as a m-16 parrot
-
havefunwithyourthirdworldcountries.jpeg
-
You know what? Fuck both of them now.
METAL STORM TIME!
Never jams. No moving parts. reload via barrel replacement.
(http://www.matthewbest.com/sitebuilder/images/story.metal.storm.fire_1_-281x217.jpg)
-
K I'll just come from behind and kick it on the ground boom
-
(http://world.guns.ru/userfiles/images/assault/as24/fal_imbel.jpg)
47 nations chose this as their main battle rifle during the time of the AK-47 and M14.
Just a thought.
-
what does it matter when the two largest weapon purchasers used the AK-47 and the M16
-
(http://world.guns.ru/userfiles/images/assault/as24/fal_imbel.jpg)
47 nations chose this as their main battle rifle during the time of the AK-47 and M14.
Just a thought.
It was the Right arm of the free world, but the AK was the only one out when the FAL came around and it cant fire Burst/Auto in an assault form.
-
Canada used the FN FAL from the 1950s to 1984. My friend's father is in the navy and said the gun wasn't very good. It has too much recoil and too small of a clip compared to the current service that we use, the Diemaco C7A1 Assault Rifle. The C7 features the structural strengthening, improved handguards, and longer stock developed for the M16A2. Diemaco changed the trapdoor in the buttstock to make it easier to access and a half-inch spacer is available to adjust stock length to user preference. The most easily noticeable external difference between American M16A2s and Diemaco C7s is the retention of the A1 style rear sights. Not easily apparent is Diemaco's use of hammer-forged barrels. The Canadians originally wished to use a heavy barrel profile instead of the M16A2 profile, but Colt denied permission. Also, Diemaco has developed a different mounting system from Colt for the M203 grenade launcher for the C7 rifle family.
-
I would pick and AK.. And whats with you European's and not wanting to kill things?! trollface
-
Holy shit, stop necroing old threads.
-
Someone is trying to keep his post count up...
-
I would prefer the AK47, it's powerful and it looks cool too! :D