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Messages - Futeko
31
« on: March 31, 2014, 07:25:15 AM »
Welcome back, Pyro  Even if you're not active IG, an extra point of view is always welcome!
32
« on: March 30, 2014, 12:26:41 PM »
Hello Naruko! Welcome to the forums
33
« on: March 29, 2014, 02:58:17 PM »
You need to seriously calm down.
If you were trying to be undercover, why did you speak out like that first things into the game? Just join the game and stay silent, no one will call you out. If you join a game and get very insistent about whether people knows there's an admin online, of course you're plainly exposing yourself. It's like asking people to hit you and then complaining afterwards that someone did.
In any case, Sputkin you shouldn't have called him out; that's still not okay to do regardless of the circumstances.
I suggest you two arrange some time off-game to have a calm discussion about this. Let's please handle this in an adult and mature way. If you really can't agree or sort things out, then just ignore each other and call it off. Right now, you're both turning this into a way bigger problem than it needs to be, and if you continue on that path, it will blow up one way or another, and that's in the interest of nobody.
34
« on: March 29, 2014, 11:25:19 AM »
Thank you very much for your report!
Sinx is known for playing soundboard sounds over the mic; it's not usually annoying like that though.
Adolf has already been reported by Ozborne for the same kind of offence, so that's his second time already. I've played a bit with him this morning and he didn't play anything, seemed rather ok as a player. I think he just needs to be scolded a bit and informed that it's not okay - I don't think there's any malicious intent, it's "just for fun", but not the good kind of fun.
I'll have a chat with them next time I see them; if they do it again I'll advocate a mute.
35
« on: March 28, 2014, 11:53:22 PM »
To be honest I'm rather surprised at the hostility you display regarding this discussion, when you stated that you wholeheartedly agreed with what was proposed in the first post.
I also feel the tone of the discussion was somewhat misunderstood - as I previously stated, this is neither an attack nor an argument, it's simply a discussion ("Hey, wouldn't it be better to do this?"). I don't feel there's a need to get on such a defensive high ground when the point is just to debate common guidelines; it feels like you're saying "I'll do it my way unless I'm given a direct order from a superior admin". No one here is trying to tell you how to do your job - but we're a team, and as a team we need to cooperate, and cooperation advocates understanding and compromising. It's kind of a cold shower to see that we're unable to have a calm, level-headed conversation about something as trivial as the publicity of an admin status.
36
« on: March 28, 2014, 11:08:08 PM »
It's not about feeling safe; you can't be threatened over the Internet, though you can be harassed or have your gameplay experience damaged or ruined by the actions of another player. If someone is there to take care of it, then great; if not, realize you can contact someone to help you.
It's actually the opposite of the given example - when minding your own business, if there's a cop watching over your shoulder, you'll feel pressured, threatened, because you'll wonder whether that cop will find something to say about what you're doing - hence why I advocate laying low.
Advertising that an admin is in the place is a short-term solution that will not help the community in the long run, because then your impact is gone the instant you leave the server. I'd even go as far as to say that going out of your way to make people know not to fuck around while you're there is more damaging than helpful, because not only will it not help with the regular offenders (they'll just hide until you're gone), but it will make non-offenders feel pressured to keep a low profile. That logic is only valid if you can be online and active 24/7, which is not the case. I'd even go further and say that in your example, the minute the cop tells you "well, I'm going on my lunch break, see you in an hour", the armed people otherwise kept at bay will jump out and ride your ass way worse than they'd otherwise have.
37
« on: March 28, 2014, 10:22:29 PM »
To be honest, I'm instead grateful for the feedback/opinion; I feel Sputkin was sort of misunderstood because of the way he expressed his opinion, which might seems commanding/harsh, when he just wanted to explain how he felt. I believe the language difference kind of made it sound bad when the intention wasn't to be like that.
On topic, I believe that making it so rules are respected only because people know someone with authority is watching is not a good method. For instance, let's say you're on a highway and you want to go above the speed limit. If you really want to, you will find a portion of road where there's no cop/radar and you'll speed all right, and you'll slow down once you see a cop car.
If people know there is an admin watching, they will behave differently; you say it's a plus, I say it's actually a bad thing:
- Offenders will just lay low and start firing once you're gone;
- Regular players will feel a pressure they'd otherwise not feel without an admin (just like you'll feel insecure when overtaking a cop car on the highway - what if the cops find something they don't like with you?).
(That's what Sputkin was saying basically).
I believe that what is important is that there is an admin online, not that people know there is an admin online. The idea is to correct bad behaviour when it arises, not to tell players that "Big Brother is watching you".
38
« on: March 28, 2014, 08:16:22 PM »
I believe you're overreacting a bit; no one here is pointing fingers in a court accusing someone of wrongdoing. Basically the whole point can be translated as such: "Hey dude, I don't think you should tell people you're an admin, it might make some people jumpy" "I agree, this can only bring trouble - let's try and stay low" So it's not a witch hunt, trial or argument - simply a discussion. Another way to look at it is: "Not telling people you're an admin: for or against?". Currently two people expressed an opinion defending "for". If you disagree and believe we should not lay low like that, feel free to pitch in, that's the whole point of the topic
39
« on: March 28, 2014, 05:55:12 PM »
Thanks Sputkin! Actually, Sputkin just described the exact situation for which I wrote the first paragraph of my rules of thumb: 1) Under normal circumstances:
- Never display yourself as an admin; by all means you are a regular player, here to enjoy the game the same way as any other player;
- Don't abuse admin powers when it isn't to battle a gameplay-damaging behaviour or to enhance the game (e.g. avoid unnecessary use of the "admin talk" commands, random effects or "slay all", etc.) You need to avoid advertising yourself as an admin under any and all circumstances, for the exact reasons Sputkin stated. If someone asks you directly whether you're an admin, either ignore them or answer something like "Who knows" and move on. And nothing in your behaviour should indicate that you're an admin, unless you are correcting an offence (even then, discretion is key). Also, one general remark I forgot to include above: as an admin, we are at the service of players, and not the opposite; any and all players should feel that way toward admins, and not feel afraid or intimidated. Secrecy and discretion are very useful tools for this.
40
« on: March 28, 2014, 10:58:47 AM »
(This post is originally made to discuss those topics along with Ozborne, but anyone is more definitely welcome to pitch in)
I believe that now that we have two admins on the server, we need to make sure that the actions we take are in tune with each other's (i.e. what doesn't fly under one should not fly under the other, and the opposite as well).
I'd thus like to discuss here how we're going to do that, because I don't think we should take lightly the responsibility we have - pragmatically, we have the power to make or break the server, and it's the only remaining ZM server left; that should not slip our mind at any point.
Overzealousness can be make things worse than ever, so carefulness in balancing leniency and respect of the rules should always be observed. We should not turn the server in a military state where you have to ask permission to sneeze, but rather help the players find an enjoyable experience when playing on it.
Right now, the rules of thumb I'd like to follow are those:
---
1) Under normal circumstances:
- Never display yourself as an admin; by all means you are a regular player, here to enjoy the game the same way as any other player;
- Don't abuse admin powers when it isn't to battle a gameplay-damaging behaviour or to enhance the game (e.g. avoid unnecessary use of the "admin talk" commands, random effects or "slay all", etc.)
2) When facing an offence:
- Always issue at least two warnings before taking any action, explaining how and why the behaviour or item is against the rules;
- If any action is to be taken, it must be to remove a bad behaviour that is evidently affecting the game;
3) Any action taken must be proportionate to the offence taking place:
- The gradation of "standard" punishments would be as follow: Slap, Slay, Kick, Ban 5m, Ban 24h;
- Any longer or otherwise permanent punishments (e.g. Permaban, Permamute, Permagag) should be discussed in the Ban Request forum;
- Only climb up the ladder of punishments against repeat offenders;
A) If a player has an offensive name:
- Two warnings;
- Rename them;
- If they change back to an offensive name, start with a Kick then go up the Ladder.
B) If a player has an offensive tag:
- Two warnings;
- Kick them then go up the Ladder.
C) If a player is playing annoying sounds or music over the mic:
- Make sure it is actually gameplay-disruptive, i.e. hurting other players; otherwise simply inform the players how to mute the player themselves;
- Two warnings;
- Mute them for 5m;
- Mute them for 24h;
- Report for a permamute on the forum.
D) If a player is being disrespectful or otherwise harassing/offensive in the chat:
- Make sure it is actually gameplay-disruptive, i.e. hurting other players;
- Two warnings;
- Gag them for 5m;
- Gag them for 24h;
- Report for a permagag on the forum.
E) If a player is trolling or griefing in general (disrupting normal gameplay by e.g. purposedly doing nothing as ZM, hindering the completion of objectives by displacing key items, destroying otherwise useful bonus such as Barrels and Barricades, blocking pathways and elevators, etc.):
- Two warnings (Make sure the player is actually aware they are disrupting normal gameplay (might simply be a newbie that doesn't know what they're doing);
- Start with a Slay then go up the Ladder.
F) If a player is hacking (speedhack or otherwise):
- Two warnings (make sure it's not simply lag or something else);
- Start with a 24h Ban;
- If it happens again, report on the forum for a Permaban.
4) If any action with a consequence longer than immediate (anything above a kick) is taken:
- Inform the offender of their possibility to challenge the action on the forums;
- Make a post on the forum explaining who, what and why so that other admins can know about it (in order to identify repeat offenders) and the offender has a place to challenge the action.
5) Exceptions (regular gameplay events that are not offences but can be disruptive):
- When a round is dragging on because the remaining survivors do not pursue the map objectives (e.g. simply holing up in a safe area): try to explain to them what they should be doing instead; if it doesn't work, shorten the round one way or another (e.g. through a vote).
---
This is not intended to be a "follow-blindly" list of rules, but rather general directions to consider when playing and filling up your role.
What are your thoughts on this? Do you have any suggestions to add to the list? Is there anything you disagree with?
41
« on: March 28, 2014, 08:40:34 AM »
I've played quite my fair share of rounds with Shiro, and from what I could see he's far from being a troll in any shape or form.
I wasn't there so I can't judge based on objective circumstances, but even if annoying sounds or music were played over the microphone, that's one of the least gameplay-damaging offences there is, greatly downplayed by the fact that players can act upon it themselves (Player List > Mute). Most of the trouble that arises from that comes from the fact some players don't know how to mute another; a simple explanation can then save the day for them (most people playing tunes over the mic will actually spontaneously explain that themselves if someone complains).
Thirdly, was any player actually offended by any of these? I know that the excuse "there isn't anyone else on the highway anyway" does not make speeding any less of an offence, but when it comes to "racism", there's real racism and then there's humour. A player named "Adolf Hitler" playing songs about black slaves sound a lot more like the second that the first to me (now there's good and bad humour, agreed, but humour nonetheless). It doesn't make it any less of an offence, but certainly not a major one. In my opinion, it only becomes a real problem when people are actually offended by the "jokes".
For those reasons, I would oppose any action against Shiro, and if any action is to be taken against that "Adolf" player, I'd certainly be opposed to a ban, as those offences are in my opinion nowhere near something that would warrant such a drastic punishment.
42
« on: March 26, 2014, 10:50:33 PM »
Were you recommended by an admin? If so state the name: I got somewhat pushed by Live Bait to write this application x) In game name: Futeko Link to your steam page: http://steamcommunity.com/id/futeko/What helpful qualities do you possess: I'm usually calm and patient, and try to understand each option or each side before taking decisions. When given responsibilities, I do my best to give a proper image of who or what I represent, and uphold the greater good of the group rather than any individual's. What country are you from: Belgium Age: 25 Microphone: Yes Do you have past admin/forum experience: Notably, 3 experiences of note: - As a teenager, I was a moderator for an FF8 forum; given my young age, mistakes were made, but it made me learn to take responsibility for them. - This is not really admin-related, but in a browser-based war game (Hyperiums) I've had been appointed as representative diplomat for my "alliance" (group of players holding a territory). I've had the opportunity to defuse threatening conflicts and arrange our integration in a larger alliance after our leader quit. It helped me develop my ability to understand and rationally approach a potentially hostile point of view and to build a compromise with it. - More recently, I've been successively officer and leader of an MMORPG guild (World of Warcraft), managing the linked forum and the in-game community. It helped me fight my shyness of "speaking out in public", enhance my ability to seek out solutions for the greater good, and realize that sometimes hard decisions have to be taken that will not leave everyone unscathed. Do you use our TS server: Presently no, as I'd normally use such a tool to speak with people playing the same game; however, I have some past experience with TS, and I'm willing to hop on it when requested or as a way to be "on-call" should there be an issue on the server and no admin is on at the time. Additional Notes: The ZM server could really use an IG admin since griefing runs rampant these days, but at the same time it's a big responsibility since it's the last active server. Each decision must be carefully weighted, as swinging the banhammer like a berserk nord certainly wouldn't help the situation. But I'm prepared to give my best to make the server and the community a better place for all. Thanks in advance for considering this application!
43
« on: March 26, 2014, 12:19:16 PM »
As evidenced by the 4th ban request I've posted in two weeks' time, the ZM server could really use an admin or two cleaning up the trolls and griefers from time to time.
Speaking of which, I'm really starting to feel weird with those requests, because there's such a thing as a "too strict enforcement"; I'd be much more relieved to have other people also playing the game and giving their opinion on those griefing cases, because the ZM community is few and scattered as it is so I'd certainly not want to be the asshole burning the ashes on some white-knighting quest.
On the other hand, those griefers might also very well be a plague that prevents the community from growing again, since it's not possible to avoid them once they're up; you never know whether you'll have a nice gaming session or a frustrated evening before you join the server, so there's definitely some cleaning to do - though I'd rather have multiple opinions on the job.
All that venting to say: if it's going to help keeping the griefers at bay on the ZM servers, I'm all up for it.
44
« on: March 26, 2014, 12:04:36 PM »
Your name in-game: Futeko Offender's name in-game: GiveUpBitch Date/Time of the offence: 26/03/2014 - around 13:48 CET SteamID: STEAM_0:0:7814822 Server: Zombie Master (ZM) Any administrators on the server?: None What was the problem/offense?: Trolling in general, namely: - Using offensive language to harass other players not agreeing with her (racial slurs, provocations) - Deliberately doing nothing as ZM in order to make for boring rounds on maps she didn't like Proof:I have recorded one Demo files illustrating the offences: - GiveUpTrolling.dem: in the map zm_countrytrain, she complained that the map was "for noobs" because it didn't allow her to spam banshees as ZM, and asked everyone to RTV. She then proceeded to do nothing as ZM for the whole round, beside harassing a player based on its name ("sub zero", as she put it, is a "gay character" and only "homos can like him"). Other comments:I've played for an hour and a half with that player, across 4 different maps, and her behaviour stayed the same the whole time - she wanted to play zm_tetris, which never got chosen, so every time a new map began, she would nominate tetris, rtv, then proceed with the above two offences until people would RTV for a new map (in-between lengthy afk breaks). Repeatedly, players have been asking her to stop and tried to reason with her, but to no avail. She simply gave us an extraordinary display of immaturity the whole time. Thanks in advance for considering this request!
45
« on: March 26, 2014, 09:31:47 AM »
^ Is probably a German werewolf in hiding
< Should be working instead of posting silly things
v Is a champion at Pong
ShoutBox!
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